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Datshiane Navanayagam talks to an ice hockey referee from Austria and a football referee from Denmark about their experiences as female officials in men's leagues. Austrian Julia Kainberger played ice hockey professionally for the Salzburg Eagles while also pursuing a career in officiating. She was one of the 12 European officials for the 2022 Beijing Winter Olympics and, in 2024, became the first female referee in a men's Champions League game. Julia looks forward to a day where no female referee has to be 'the first one' anymore and it becomes the norm. Frida Klarlund is a Danish football referee who has officiated international matches since 2015.  In 2021 she became the first woman to referee in the men’s second division. Frida has refereed at major tournaments such as the Women’s Champions League, World Cup qualifiers and the Women's Euros. She currently works in Denmark’s top women’s league. Produced by Emily Naylor (Image: (L) Julia Kainberger courtesy Julia Kainberger. (R) Frida Klarlund credit UEFA.)